So my local DVD rental store has this 3 for 2 deal on new(ish) releases, and as a result I’ve recently found myself watching a lot of add-on, look-it’s-for-no-extra-charge-might-as-well-have-it, third-choice movies.
Depressingly, a high proportion of these have been SF.
Equally depressingly, on viewing these movies, my lowered, oh-well-not-like-I-paid-for-it expectations have been pretty much seamlessly met.
Is it just me? Let’s see. Here, in alphabetical order, are the last three SF movies I rented – try to guess which one wasn’t a third choice freebie, which one I actually paid for (and felt good about paying for when I’d seen it).
Moon
Star Trek
Terminator: Salvation
For extra credit, fit each film with one of the descriptors in the title of this post.
I’m going with the same order as the headline, though the last two could go either way, sadly.
Haven’t seen Moon, but ST was Utterly Fucking Banal and T:S was Bad, so that leaves Good.
So I’m going with 1, 3, 2.
You clearly bought Moon which if not good, was excellent.
I’ve seen Star Trek and was immensely disappointed – we’ll call that Bad.
And everything I’ve heard about the latest Terminator effort means it easily slips into the pigeon hole marked Utterly Fucking Banal.
Still I could swap the last two around but that’s my call. Where’s my prize?
I’m going also with the same order as the headline, though S:T had a lot of fun at least. Irrelevant and fully incoherent, but fun at the end
ST and T:S truly sucked, didn’t they? I feel a bit weird saying it as a sf writer, but there are times I feel like giving up entirely on the genre as far as the silver screen is concerned.
I’ve heard good things about Moon – it’s not exactly a struggle to guess that’s the one you’re referring to – although I’ll admit I was tempted to avoid it after reading a fairly excoriating review of it on Nancy Kress’s blog (her tolerance for idiot plots is about the same as mine, ie non-existent).
Finally a safe zone to lambast the popular culture. I tried this with sci fi books with deadly results.
Star Wars had put out some book about Leia’s and Han’s son was back to destroy the universe…Clearly belongs on a dusty bookshelf.
Batman Forever is the sci fi older movie that I picked up lately.
The dialogue is witty from Chase’s intense fixation on unsuiting the bat to the Riddler.
Around the time this video came out, so did a report from psychology today that brains were really being analyzed and scanned.
I ran scared to my psych prof who just laughed at me. Maybe she was in bed with Jim Carrey’s the Riddler.
What was interesting to me about this film is the statue outside of Batman Bruce Wayne’s home of a mman holding an Atlas on his shoulders.
I am currently reading Ayn Rand’s Atlas Shrugged and often with the rest of them wonder WHO IS JOHN GALT? The man who threatens to stop the motor of the world. The man who controls the world from behind the scenes. I haven’t finished the book yet but think it and Batman Forever are worthy art. Also, be sure to check out the music to Batman Forever. “The Hunter Gets Captured by the Chase” is interesting when considering Alice In Wonderland.
So – extra credit goes to Ken; the rest of you guys hedged too much
Gary – yeah, I heard about NT’s lambasting of Moon, and just went across there now to check it out. Suffice to say I think she’s being a bit obtuse about the movie’s scenario and thematic intent; reading between the lines, I’m guessing she didn’t like Moon for fairly visceral reasons, and then retro-actively made a list of ostensibly “stupid” SF-logistical errors in the script with which to justify that visceral response.
In fact most of those points can, I think, be fairly easily refuted if you care to make the effort, but as I said above, I think that would be missing the point of the movie rather hugely. Any case, I wouldn’t let her put you off. Moon is not, as some pundit declared, the finest SF movie since Bladerunner, but it is something pleasingly different, and it jars the genre (in movie terms, that is) by being unusually (a) intelligent and (b) genuinely moving. It uses a fairly standard SF conceit to tell a very simple, very human story, and I’d love to think it might be the start of a new trend in that direction.
Star Trek and Terminator; Salvation on the other hand…….. Well, I’ll probably rant more specifically about them a bit later. Right now, I’m really too incoherent with disgust to do the task justice.
NT should, of course, read NK back there – bit sleepy when I posted.
Is Moon similar to Solaris? I’ve been meaning to see it for some time. That and District 9, which I hear is quite good.
I was trolleyed when I saw the new ST film (which made it pleasant – but I couldn’t remember much about it afterwards – probably a good thing.
Terminator Salvation was pants.
Ravs
To be honest I don’t think there’s a whole lot of quality Sci-fi out there on the screens at the moment.
The only good thing i’ve seen recently was ‘Pandorum’, which i’d recommend having a look at. It’s fairly limited, but it keeps a straight face and doesn’t feel like just another reheat of the Star Wars/Star Trek universes.
Not sure if it would classify as Sci-fi but Richard Linklater’s ‘A Scanner Darkly’ is worth watching. About as good an adaption of P.K.Ds novel as you could expect.
Otherwise – if you’re willing to take a dip into the much-maligned Anime genre – then you can’t go wrong with Ghost In The Shell. Avoid the three movies until you’ve watched the ‘Stand Alone Complex’ series. It’s real quality stuff; a world apart from your standard Anime fare. The attention to detail is phenomenal and the makers don’t seem too concerned about every viewer understanding every plot point, which makes a nice change.
I’d never even heard of Moon, and sure enough IMDB says it’s a UK release. If it really is good, especially mildly intelligent (god forbid) it won’t reach these shores. 2) T:S I’d assumed would be so bad I wouldn’t even watch it for free (besides, it’s too reminiscent of Schwarznegger, my current governator.) Star Trek, come on, it’s totally American apple pie and what America is all about – banality. However, ST did a good thing – it encouraging my daughter to watch TOS.
Linda
Hi Linda!
TOS?
You old cynic, Neal!
Yeah, you’re probably right where a lot of critics are concerned, and especially those in genre. I just hold out this naive hope for balanced and thoughtful critical response…….
I should’ve said ST:TOS Star Trek: The Original Series. My daughter watched the entire series and was astonished that most of the plots she’d seen on SF series since then were stolen from ST:TOS. (However, when I watched TOS with her I didn’t remember the eps being quite that boring – well maybe they didn’t seem boring in the 60s!).
More research into Moon. As far as I can tell, it was only released in NY and LA. Will be out here in Jan on DVD.
Or I could order it from the UK as I converted my DVD player to region free…
Linda
I did like Star Trek. Moon was better, but I enjoyed Star Trek a lot. I was mostly watching because of its slash potential, so I may be biased.
I’m… not even going to comment on Terminator. I’ve seen maybe ten seconds of a trailer, and it looked really bad. I do want one of the toys they made for it, but only because it is apparently a good size for converting into a dropship or something for wargaming, but the film? Oh god, no.
“I’m guessing she didn’t like Moon for fairly visceral reasons, and then retro-actively made a list of ostensibly “stupid” SF-logistical errors in the script with which to justify that visceral response.”
Haven’t you just summed up the entire reviewing process? Visceral reaction followed by justification?
See, now you’ve made me spit wine on my keyboard, Richard.
Ah, I see that we’ve had our answer.
However, it’s the Internets so I’ll weigh in with opinion regardless (muwhahaha).
I enjoyed Moon – it’s not the greatest SF film evaaaarrrr or anything like that. What I liked about it was that it seemed to ditch all of the post Star Wars baggage that so much of SF in films seems to have nowadays. It seemed to follow on more from introspective 70s films like Silent Running or Dark Star (both of which also had their flaws) and didn’t rely on things blowing up every 15 minutes for thrills. I didn’t leave the cinema feeling as though I’d had my intelligence insulted, which, as a paying customer, I feel I am entitled to…
Cheers,
Richard
PS Oh, and Ravs – yeah District 9 is pretty good (the metaphor is pretty obvious if nicely done) although it again degenerated into a big chase with shit blowing up. That said, I subsequently read a review that made the same point and then said “well, at least by the end the film had earned it” – which is fair comment!
Yeah, might have to go across there and clear that up, in fact.
That whole SF/F thing has always struck me as the most illusory of divides anyway.
3rd time!
Oh, and wildly off topic did you see this post?
http://blog.markcnewton.com/2009/12/03/why-sf-is-dying-fantasy-fiction-is-the-future/#comment-1832
Interested to note that your reasons for writing a fantasy trilogy are being second guessed….
Yeah–I tend to veer off topic from time..
To go off topic further: Good News *I gave up on being a Chinese Nationalist*.
Back to movies:
I thought you all might enjoy rewatching the Batman Forever movie with today’s perspective.
I hadn’t seen Moon or Star Trek. John Nash intrigued me from Terminator Salvation but I am always a sucker for men determined to save humanity and freedom.
Cya.
JH
Still to see Moon, but I found the new ST fairly entertaining, in a ‘switched off while viewing’ sorta way. As for T:S… it pulled me along until HBC turned up as the face of skynet. Too much cinematic cheddar from then on.
Mark C
IF you didn’t like Star Trek, we have a problem, so I’m going with that as your top choice.
I haven’t seen Moon, but it didn’t get whatcha call just real good reviews, so I’m thinking that was your freebie.
I actually just bought Terminator Salvation myself and, yes, I was a whole lot less than happy with it, so that would be my pick for the Bad.
“Show him what he’s won, Johnny..!”
Someone on Malazan had a brilliant idea. You need to clone yourself so one of you can work full time on your next book!
Impatiently waiting for Sept 2010,
Linda
Moon was released in theaters around the US shortly after its LA NY release. Good flick. Terminator was directed by a guy that calls himself McG (if your work ever gets made into a move pray that he does not direct it) and the script was thoroughly rewritten after Christian Bale signed on for a minor part as John Connor. Star Trek was an origin story for people who just wanted it back on the screen. I enjoyed the characters but the plot was pretty terrible. Adding on to the fact that the director of the new star trek preferred star wars and had never really watched star trek made all the space scenes feel like episode 3. At least they weren’t Pandorum. Moon good. Star Trek bad. Terminator was fucking soulless.
Haven’t seen any of these yet. I have no patience for Terminator in general, so I’ll probably skip that. I dunno. The premise for Moon just didn’t grab me, but all my favorite authors seem to love it so I suppose I’ll give it a shot at some point. As for Star Trek, I’m just not into the franchise.
The best movie I’ve seen lately was a Korean drama called Punch Lady. It reminded me a little of Million Dollar Baby premise-wise, but absolutely blew that out of the water in execution.
I also wanted to briefly stick my neck out in defense of major franchises, and specifically in defense of licensed fiction. A lot of it is utterly fucking banal, to borrow your phrase. But at least in Star Wars there are good things happening. I’d point in particular to the Republic Commando quartet by Karen Traviss. Her site is worth a read, particularly the FAQ section. She’s interesting for me because she writes really good books but reads no fiction and never has.
~DJ
>>> At least they weren’t Pandorum. < <<
What was so terrible about Pandorum? I’ll admit, it wasn’t the best movie ever made, but i’m curious as to why you disliked it so.
Hmm. There was another fairly recent-ish Sci-Fi movie: Eden Log. Very, very atmospheric, but not the sort of thing you recommend to a friend. At times it’s pretty hard going on the viewer. Mostly the movie involves looking at a blue/black screen wondering what the fuck is going on whilst listening to Clovis Cornillac grunt his way through a hellish subterranian maze.
Still, I would watch that any day over T:S or a Transformers movie.
You don’t watch any schwarzenegger
related films seeking enlightenment. Like Conan the Barbarian, The Terminator series is all about just a display of testerone and arms. So my arguement is that its a good BAD movie. We all watch those from time to time…JH
Pandorum felt incredibly forced. Had it been made in a dead tree version and read in your home it could have been an entertaining romp through a sci-fi opera/horror setting. But it wasn’t. And as such it was subject to the 2 hour rule of cinema. Then there was the ending. Personally it pissed me off.
But then again thats just me. Richard did not enjoy Star Trek apparently. Being raised on the stuff I was glad it was back on the screen. Even though the story was ultimately generic and the red matter just made me cringe.
I absolutely agree with the rating of those three movies. I’m my opinion there were only 3 SF movies worth watching this year. Actually, make that 3 in the last 4-5 yrs. The first and best would have to be District 9. Just forgetting the apartheid metaphor for a second, it was nice to see a SF movie where humanity doesn’t play the victim to some horrible, reptilian(insert gross flavor of the month)alien. Too often, we are portrayed in the beginning as weak until someone or something occurs in order for us to overthrow our would be oppressors. I felt that District 9 explored rather well our oft ignored darker side.
The second place would have to go to Moon. I’d read/heard a few good things about this movie, so that when the chance presented itself to actually see it I couldn’t let it pass. And Boy was it ever refreshing. From a cinematographic standpoint alone this flick is a gem. Can you say stop-motion animation in an age dominated by CGI-3D-Imax-shit-so-real-your-eyes-bleed. And then, once you get over how well it’s filmed, and focus on the acting,…well…simply outstanding.
Finally, and hear me out on this one before you disagree, third place would have to go to Pandorum……and here’s why in one word: Dead Space! If any of you have ever had the chance to play this Xbox 360/PS3 horror game you know where I’m coming from! The atmosphere in Pandorum was identical to the one found while playing Dead Space. The sense of isolation, the fear of what might lie in the gloom just around the corner, the feeling of someone just out of sight, creeping up on you, the irrational fear of wide open spaces….well, all I have to say is play the game then watch the movie. The similarities are plentiful. If you like/liked Dead Space, then you’ll more than just enjoy Pandorum.
P.S.: Speaking of Dead Space, the sequel:Dead Space 2 was officially announced this week for a late 2010 release date! if you haven’t played the first game yet, pick it up now, and I dare any of you to play it in the dark alone late at night if you’re brave enough…I wasn’t!
Ouch. Thats a big disservice to Dead Space. I just about shit myself playing Dead Space. Pandorum not so much.
Here’s what I’m thinking, after reading all this. Sci Fi and Science Fiction movies have so little in common, it is really kind of pointless comparing the two. Anyone expecting to find the kind of real science in, say, a Stephen Baxter or Greg Bear novel, not to mention someone like Hal Clement.. well, you’re going to be sorely disappointed. So called Sci Fi movies are almost always more about action and adventure than plausibility.
Take, for instance, “MOON.” What are the chances, seriously, that anyone would set up a remote base like that, with only one human being manning it? I don’t care how many AIs or robots are available, there would be more than one human being there. But, then, where would the tension and drama be?
Lots of folks made reference to “District 9″ as well. Personally, I loved it, but there are so many holes in the plot and believability of the situation, you could march the Third Armored Division through them.
So, what’s my point, then? Pretty much this. I can and often do dispel my disbelief when I watch these types of movies (same with Fantasy and the like), because I am there for the simple reason that I want to be entertained. IF the effort is put forth and I am, then I am happy. I don’t have to have everything be perfect, or even believable.
Or.. maybe I’m missing the point.
In any event, that’s what I was thinking, in the event anyone gives a hairy expletive…
And so on and so forth.
I’d cite “District 9″ as another good sci-fi film. It has its flaws but i think it makes up for them in having a repugnant “hero”.
Another, surprisingly mature, example is the CG movie “Battle for terra” which has the scenario of humans taking over a planet becasue they destroyed earth and their mothership is on its last legs. The humans are “bad” but their reasons are justified. Things get murkier when the “cute” aliens turn out to be less than perfect too. I suspect this will end up being a far better movie than “Avatar” – but will make far less cash.
Throwing my 2 cents into the pit of oppinion. i think most people got your list right, in the order it was in Moon – ST:TOS – T:S and here is my reasoning Moon brought something gentle back to big screen sci-fi that has been missing. Everyone remember those great authors that could tell immense stories without it reaching 50-70% Fight scenes/Political machinations? (not that theres anything wrong with a fuckload of gore and backstabbing but le guin/hienlien and co. could pull it off) Moon reminded me of (and disappointed my becuase of)Robert Heinliens ‘The Moon is a Harsh Mistress’ but without… Hmmm the spine. ST:TOS alot of TOS has actually dated alright compared to modern SF series – the plots were orignal for the time and immersive elements of earnest drama from the cast aid this. And Finally. There is only one reason to See/Own S:T and that is if you or your partner find Sam Worthington Dead-fucking-Sexy chained up (as my other half does) The New ST movie, as i see alot of pople assumed you were talking about, wasnt terrible but was instead a resounding “Meh” the only worthwhile part of the whole movie was when they sent singularities into the planetcore – Made me hope J.J was going to be doing the Hyperion (dan simmons)movies but alas he’s not.
Disctrict9 was a really good sci-fi flick best in a while actually, although i still believe alot more could have been achieved had it been made into a tv series. I’ve found a nice fanfictionesque Movie with ron pearlman and Malcovich in it – Mutant Chronicals – If anyone Loved Fallout3 or the earlier games this movie is for you.
I’d agree with a few of the posts that most Sci-fi Movies are on the whole absoloute garbage. And it seems that if you want a better Trashshit2Smashhit ratio you really have to start looking into Anime series/movies – Justa few of the Best – Akira, Ghost in the Shell, Evangelion(series), Macross(series)- there are plenty of modern ‘classics’on the shelf of your local Manga/Anime shop.
One other thing i’ve noticed, even though its not strictly sci-fi, is that most recent Super Hero movies have all just Bastardized the first Burton Batman (keaton was the best batman ever- your an inbred with more thumbs than teeth if you disagree) This is no more evident than the 2nd punisher Movie ‘Warzone’ which i actually quite enjoy as it was very true the the comic version of the character, anyway Punisher warzone IS Burtons Batman script just with Punisher inserted instead of batman and Jigsaw replacing Joker.
Thats enough of my Deluge, escept for one parting comment – RKM if they Fuck Alterd Carbon up you had better be ready to wave Kovac #4 in everyones drooling faces cause ima be a one man riot if it’s a lieghtweight adaption of your Killer Novel-
Smoke On~ Freeman
amen to that Freeman! Too true. Maybe someone somewhere should come up with a better way of translating literature to film. The current hollywood method seems to destroy more than it creates. The only notable exception being the Starwars original trilogy. Then hollywood realised what they had done and decided to correct it and fuck it up by releasing the most recent trilogy of the same name! I mean Seriously, the snow covered tree outside my window has more acting panache in it’s roots than the actor chosen to play Vader it recent years!
A last note – Totally agree with you Rich – There is alot of simillar expectation from the book to the big screen which is what leads to disappointedment – but ones immersion into the ‘fantasy’ of these peices of entertainment will only be determined by how willing the auidience is to be immersed in the firstplace. I find that as soon as a Big-screen sci-fi starts becoming more like a half baked action film i start to care less and less about the fiction or my immersion into it.
Anyone see “Surrogates?” Surprisingly good, I though, at least as a low-budget elaboration on a cool concept (not unlike RKM’s ‘sleeving’).
Just in case anyone missed it-when I call V for Vendetta a gem I am being deeply deeply ironic. It was bloody awful in every way.
Ok I think I understand what Richard is alluding to here. He has a movie with the potential for greatness in development in the hollywood system at the moment but an uncomfortably large percentage of SF movies released from that same system are….well….crap. Its worrying to say the least. Couple that with the strong possibility that the person sitting in the directors chair will be the same guy who directed the unforgettable cinematic gem that was V for Vendetta and its downright alarming.
Personally I’m torn. While I would love to see Mr Morgans work brought to the attention of a much wider audience and I know that being the one chosen from the bazillions of stories out there to actually have ones book made into a movie is nothing short of miraculous it would be an absolute shame to see a book like AC fall into the hands of a director who simply does not have the necessary ability or experience to do the material justice. I see nothing in Mr Mcteigues previous or current directorial efforts to suggest that he has either.
Which leaves us with the question of who should be the one to direct AC? Off the top of my head-what about the Wachowskis? We know they have the ability to make a great movie-ok they haven’t used that ability for about ten years but I think the time is right for them to make a comeback. They deserve to be redeemed and AC should be the movie that gives them the opportunity to do it and show the world what they can do once more. I feel an online petition coming on….Wachowskis for Altered Carbon. Who’s with me?
@ davietidings
You want the guys who had their hands all over that “unforgettable cinematic gem” to direct AC?
–Lizzy
The “genius” behind “V” isnt the only no-neck that gotten hands on sci-fi monsterworks recently…. Dan Simmons Hyperion Cantos and Endymion Saga are being butcher into 2 movies by the thumbless wonder behind the day the earth stood still and his Illium and olympus novels are being done by then “A-team” behind the day after tomorrow i have little hope either will be all that great but on a upside Dan Simmons has Retained Executive Producer Rights for Illium and Olympus so Something good might actually come of that arrangement
i read they turned philip j farmer’s riverworld series into another failed series again? the first attempt a few years back was horrible to say the least… if there’s one series of books that lends itself to be filmed it’s this series, unbelievable how they manage to fuck up every time they try…
personally i really enjoyed primer, made for only 7000$, doesn’t get much smarter than that movie..
gotta watch this district 9 movie, got it at home already…
I didn’t mind star trek or Terminator. But to clarify. I went in expecting something worse then terminator 3 and something well…i’m a star wars fan who hates trekkies on principal =p so i was kinda just expecting cool special effects from that one.
And to be honest terminator 4 was better then terminator 3, which isn’t saying alot, but it meant it beat my expectations and gave me some decent actions scenes to boot.
Same goes for star trek. Plot was a bit wtf this is stupid. But the special effects were cool and the action alright.
So i guess what i’m saying is, they both fail utterly as science fiction movies, but they do alright as a pointless action movie.
Mr. Morgan,
It is unfortunate that you have decided to become an agent of subversion for the anti-Star Trek revamp lobby. I quite liked your books until now.
Seeing as you did not bother to offer (me the peruser of your Web site) the courtesy of indicating the abnormal leanings of your moviegoing opinions, I choose to reciprocate by not offering you the courtesy of perusing any of your future titles. Except when I want to.
With Regards,
Chris
Haven’t actually seen Moon yet (but plan to – Sam Rockwell is tops), did enjoy Star Trek quite a bit and fell asleep during the Terminator.
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JQD One particular on the best internet sites for relevant information on this niche !! -MU….